1992-10-07-Love, (Norson Substitutes)

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Topic: Love, (Norson Substitutes)

Group: Indianapolis TeaM

Facilitators

Teacher: Norson, Oren, Andrew, Andrea

TR: Unknown

Session

Opening

NORSON: Good evening brothers and sisters. This is Norson. As Welmek instructed you last week, I and some visitors will be providing the lesson for this evening. Tonight we will first provide a lesson on the nature of love; following that I will entertain questions. And after that there are some visitors who would like to share a few words with you.

Lesson

Love

Love is a word in your language that has as many meanings as there are individuals on your planet. Like all words such as faith, your understanding of love grows as you grow. If there were one "definition" for the word, it is the definition that was given in your previous lessons and is from your text. That is, "Love is the desire to do good to others."(56:10.21)

Your text also emphasizes the importance of a parent-child relationship. The reason is that parental love is a different aspect, a somewhat different manifestation of love than the love you have for your spouse that is also associated with affection. The love that a parent has for a child comes closest to the love that the Father has for each of you; for in truth, you are all sons and daughters of the Father, your heavenly parent.

It is also important to try to come to an understanding of the distinction between this parental or fatherly love and brotherly love, the love you have for your sisters and brothers. As you go about your daily routine, you have been instructed to look at each of your brothers and sisters and to try to envision either the Father fragment within them or Michael within them. It really does not matter, whatever you feel most comfortable with is fine. You have been instructed to treat that person in the way you would if you truly sensed that the Father or Michael were within that person.

Stop for just a moment and look at one of your brothers and sisters in this room. Gaze into their eyes, and envision that the love of the Father or of Michael is there within them, wanting to be released, wanting to flow outward. Stop and do this for a moment. (pause) I realize that this may seem a little difficult, may seem a little awkward, since many of you may not know each other well. But this is exactly the point. No matter who you meet in your daily life, strangers that you pass upon the street walking by, you must begin to realize that they have this same potential within them.

You may look at someone and you may see that physically they may not be attractive to you. You may feel that they are not particularly bright intellectually, and you might even sense that spiritually they seem asleep. Yet I wish to attest and confirm to you that this Father fragment dwells within each and every one. As you learn to love your brothers and sisters, you are learning to say to yourself "What can I do that would be good for this person?"

Oftentimes, you want to sit down with them and have them sit at your feet so to speak, and let yourself expound upon all that you have learned and all that you know. Yet this may be too much. You must start in small ways, a smile, a kind word, helping them in a troubling situation, doing small favors for them. You should not underestimate the importance of these things. While it might seem small to you, again you must realize that the Father fragment is within them waiting to adjust their minds. When something positive happens to them, this is, in a sense, spiritual food for their own spirit, their own Thought Adjuster, to utilize in helping to adjust their mind.

Suppose for example that a person was having a difficult day and had many bad experiences, and you give a warm smile or kind word. As you know from your text, a little bit of good can overcome a lot of bad. Their Adjuster might be able to impress upon their mind or adjust their thinking to realize that no matter how many bad or difficult things happen in their day, that there are still good people in the world and that despite all of the problems, love still dominates. This can make them have the courage and the strength and the faith to face many more difficulties, many more challenges in their life.

Does it seem somewhat remarkable to you that such a small thing could become so important to someone else? I say to you now that this is absolutely true. You cannot underestimate the importance of such things in your life. Is this so difficult for you to do? Do you have to really go out of your way or be burdened by performing such small acts for your brothers and sisters? Some of you think you must do great things, but we are here to say it is often the small things that can be the most important.

This is what is meant by doing good for others. Of course if you get to know them and you have an opportunity to share God's love with them, this is also something that you most certainly want to do. But it is pointed out only to make a distinction that not all situations will be so opportune, that you must look for the little things and try to do them as best you can.

You would be surprised at how many opportunities you pass up every day in your life to do these small things because you are more concerned or think it is more important to do the greater things. Do not make this judgment. Allow yourself to allow God's love to flow through you in small things as well as bigger things. Look for these opportunities each day. Do not be the judge. Let God be the judge of what this person needs and how much they can absorb at a particular time. As you know, if you are able to do this, and circumstances would allow that this person would come to know you better, then they might open up to you and ask the kinds of questions that you want so badly to provide the answer for. This is the nature of brotherly concern, of brotherly love.

Parental, fatherly love, is somewhat different. It goes beyond this step of brotherly love. It adds new dimensions to it. One of the differences is that as a parent, you are more responsible for guiding your children than you are your brothers and sisters. This is a large responsibility. All of you who have had the experience of parenting know how difficult this can be at times. What is the right thing to do, how to guide your child in a way that allows their freedom and their spirit to grow, but yet would not put them into harmful situations. These are difficult assessments, difficult judgments.

The Father indwells each of you, and the Father is your parent, your guide. He provides that function for you. While you do not always understand that at the time, and while you sometimes move in directions that you rebel against, you must learn to follow His wisdom. You must learn to follow His way. You must learn to trust His guidance and His judgment, just as you wish your own child would trust your guidance. You must admit that having a perfect guide inside you is somewhat easier to trust than your own children trusting you with your limited human judgment. But yet, what is your desire with your children? Your desire is to love them, to see them grow healthy, to see them be happy and to guide them in a way that they will reach their full potential. This is exactly the same guidance, the same goals that the Adjuster has for each of you. This is, again, why your text emphasizes the importance of the parental experience, because love associated with the wisdom necessary for this guidance is part of that experience and will help you understand what the Adjuster is trying to do for each of you. (47:1.6)

I will stop now, and I will entertain questions about this lesson or about other topics concerned with your spiritual growth.

Dialogue

Q. Norson, it seems to me that it is not human nature to love. It seems as though our animal instincts are just quite the opposite. When we resurrect and have morontial form or morontial nature, is it easier, is it more automatic to love than it is for us here now?

A. First, I will answer your assumption about it is not human nature to love. This is not correct. The difficulty on your world and on primitive-type worlds is that you are largely dominated by your animal fear. It is not that it is not in your nature to love, it is not that you do not want to love, but the fear surrounding the everyday existence clouds this love and makes it, makes the person, distrustful. When someone is distrustful they hold back their love.

Concerning reaching the mansion worlds, it is not that the love within you is different, but it would be fair to say that it is more easy to release, simply because you are with other people who are more loving and more willing to release that love. The love is there, the love is within you. It is truly a matter of being willing to trust enough to allow that love to flow out to others.

Q. Norson, one of the things that you said about the difference between the love of the Father and brotherly love makes me wonder, as teachers, is your approach more brotherly or fatherly towards us? Is your attitude more brotherly or fatherly?

A. As Norson, I feel brotherly love towards you; while I, along with Welmek and other teachers who have spoken to you are more advanced in our understanding, in our spiritual awareness than you are, still, we are more on the level of brothers and sisters. When I perform the particular function of serving as a teacher or a guide for you, I am attempting to act in a more fatherly way. Therefore, by nature our relationship is more brother and sister; but by virtue of when I am acting in this function of teacher, I am trying to utilize more of the aspects of the fatherly love for you.

Q. As a teacher, in what way are those aspects fatherly, or in what ways, I guess?

A. Because my role is to help guide you in your spiritual growth, therefore, just as you are when a child comes to you and requests certain things, do you not deny the child certain of their requests? And why would you do this?

Q. Sometimes it's not appropriate, at that time, for that child to have what they want.

A. Excellent response. So it is with us as teachers in guiding you and so it is with your spirit fragment in guiding you.

Q. Norson, are you saying that human beings neither create nor store love but are merely transmitters of God's love?

A. Love exists all around you and throughout the universe. It is there, it flows through you, it is within you, it is all around you. The more you give, the more you receive. There is a sensing within you that the more you try to love your brothers and sisters, your children, your spouse, anyone that you meet, the more you give out this love, it is a sense in which there creates a larger opening, a larger vessel within you to allow love to flow in and fill this. The experience or the sensing that you have is when you give out this love you experience perhaps briefly, a sort of emptiness; but very quickly you are filled. And when you experience this flow, this ebb and flow of love outward, and then being filled, you sense yourself being more filled with love inside you.

Motivation

Q. Is it the attempt to love one another which is important, or is it the act of loving one another which is important?

A. How would you distinguish between the two?

Q. There's a writer on Urantia who has a quote which says something to the effect that if you see somebody coming to do you good, take off running. That the attempt to other people good may not be interpreted by them as an attempt to do them good. I'm saying I suppose that the motivation that we have subjectively sometimes turns out objectively different.

A. I understand. First of all, it is your motivation which is most important concerning your own spiritual welfare. However, there is an important question which you have raised concerning what truly is good for another person. Here again you must ask the question, who will decide? Will you, in your limited experience and with your limited minds, make the judgment of what is good for your brother and sister? Or will you seek guidance, will you still your mind and will you ask the spirit guide within you "What can I do that would be good for my brother or sister?" I would say, that if you do this, if you ask for inner guidance as to what is good for your brother and sister, then the motive and the objective reality of what is good will coincide. If you desire to do good but you interpret what that means by some dogma or creed or other body of rules that have been made by man or by your own intellect, then it is less likely that your intent and the reality of what is good for that other person will coincide.

Risk

Q. Norson, as I understand what you're saying, the inability of human beings to permit God's love to flow through them is because human beings are dominated by animal fear; and that because of that animal fear, there is a distrust of others and also of the experience of love. Am I correct in understanding you to suggest that in order for us to be more trusting and for others to trust us that we should take more risks in revealing ourselves to others?

A. Yes, I think as a general statement, that would be correct. However, you must also remember the statement that was made by Jesus "Do not cast pearls before swine."(140:3.18) It is always judgment. You must always use inner guidance and your wisdom to discern the best way to handle situations. But I would say that with most of your brothers and sisters, unless you perceive some immediate harm or unless you perceive some immediate difficulty by making such attempts, that it is always better to take the risk. If you see that it is not received, then you can simply, politely, withdraw and move about your business. But if you are not sure, first seek your own inner guidance. Unless you sense a real danger and if your inner guidance does not seem as clear as you might like it, why not take the risk? What do you have to lose?

Q. Norson, in the Urantia Book, it says that God is love, but love is not God. Would you explain that?

A. God is all things. Therefore, whatever you can think of as good and as positive is an attribute of God. However, the attribute itself cannot be the thing of which it is an attribute. Therefore, love is a part of God; love is an aspect of God. But love, itself, is not God. God is even more than love.

Frustration

Q. Norson, I have a question that's kind of a curiosity. As a parent I know I get frustrated at times with my child, and I wonder if the Father gets frustrated with us.

A. Frustrated is an interesting word. Why would you say that you experience frustration with your child?

Q. When he vents anger at me. And I think sometimes we vent anger at the Father too.

A. When your child was very young, and it said something negative to you because the child not get what it wanted, did you sense that the child truly did not love you? Or did you ever feel that you truly did not love your child?

Q. No.

A. Then so it is with the Father. You must understand that you are still truly very young children; and you simply do not understand many things. Therefore, the Father has infinite love and infinite patience. I do not think that frustration would be an accurate word as an expression of a feeling of your spirit fragment.

Energy

Q. Norson, does love have the same meaning as spiritual energy, the way you've described the flow of it; or does spiritual energy have other qualities as well?

A. All life in a certain sense is energy. There are physical energies that relate to the material world. Love, in a sense, is a spiritual energy; but it is an energy that is different from just physical energies because it contains within it a qualitative difference reflecting the interrelationships between personalities. Whereas, merely physical energies would not have such a quality associated with them. So, yes, you could say that love is a form of spiritual energy. It is somewhat more complicated than that, but for now that is sufficient and an accurate description.

Q. Norson, will the Father be a visual experience for us, or will it be more like an internal experiencing of Him within us?

A. When you fuse with your Father fragment, no other personalities are able to distinguish the difference between you and the Adjuster. Therefore, as you can see, you would not really be able to see the Adjuster as outside of or different from yourself. It is part of you, it is within you, all around you; it is part of your very being.

Stillness

Q. In the morning when I get up I try to devote time to meditating and to trying to communicate with the spirit fragment, but I find that my mind constantly..it's like it's trying to fight me, and I have trouble concentrating. I'm wondering if this is just a lack of discipline or I'm beginning to question my faith somewhat. How do I determine that, number one, and what can I do?

A. It is truly a matter of practice. If you desire to seek the stillness, to worship the Father, there is nothing that can stand in your way. And as you practice, you will find that it becomes much easier to do. Welmek has discussed this process with you in previous instruction. I would encourage you to go back and read earlier transcripts relating to this question. But in brief, I will say, focus on the Father as the most wonderful, the most loving, the most wise being you can possibly imagine. And picture yourself standing or sitting next to this being. How could you want to divert your attention away from this being? He is there, He surrounds you with love, He is there to answer all of your questions, to take your sorrows away. How could you not want to spend all day in the presence of such a being? How can you let thoughts of daily routine and activities flood your mind? You must focus on this image. You must thank the Father. You must have a conversation with the Father; and as you learn to concentrate and to revel being for a brief time in your busy day in the presence of such a being, you will begin to look forward every day to this time, to the point where you will cherish it above everything else. And if you were to miss it on any day, you would truly feel a sense of loss. I realize that many of you are trying and many of you may not yet have reached this point, but I can assure you that if you continue to seek this stillness daily, continue to seek the presence of the Father, there will truly come a time when what I have just said will be more real to you than anything else you see around you.

Q. Norson, we speak of giving love; and I think the other side of the same coin is we also must learn to receive love. Do you have any comments as to how we can better receive love that is (?) to us?

A. When you offer love to your brothers and sisters or to your children, you know what a wonderful feeling inside it is to allow this love to flow through you and to sense yourself being filled with even more love. Why would you ever refuse such love from one of your brothers and sisters? Why would you ever deny them the opportunity to experience this true joy?

Q. Me personally, I do my best not to. However, there are people who, as Jeff mentioned earlier, that turn and run or by the same token don't recognize or are afraid to receive love for some reason or another. What can be said to those people; or if you're one of those people, how do you deal with it?

A. If you were to walk into a room and a stranger that you did not know ran up to you and threw his arms around you and jumped all over the room with you, hugging you, and telling you how much he loved you, do you think that you might turn and run away?

Q. It depends. (group laughter)

A. You must learn to make wise judgments and you must learn to assess what is appropriate for this person. You can overteach the child; you can "overlove" the person in a sense that what you are trying to offer, the way you are trying to manifest this love may be too uncomfortable, may be more than what this person can understand at any given time. So you must learn to listen. You must learn to watch. You must learn to detect the little things about this person. Look for small openings to do small things. Do not rush in and try to overteach or overlove. Accept people where they are. Do not throw your own expectations around them. Look at them, listen to them, try to understand them; and try to give them the spiritual food that is appropriate for them at the time. If you do this, and if your relationship with them continues over time, there will come a time when you may sit with them and you may feast upon the full vision of love, as you understand it. But do not expect everyone to be able to understand this, at first.

Q. Norson, as (you) probably know, we are a curious lot. Are you willing to share with us what is your background, and what made you seek this mission?

A. I am of the Melchizidek order of beings. Our order is described in your text. (35:2) We basically perform in the universe as teachers and philosophers. My brother, Machiventa Melchizedek, is your planetary prince. Before his appointment, I served temporarily in this role, and was in charge of the receivership of your planet. As a Melchizedek, we are in charge of this mission, this teaching mission, and so it is my nature and it is my true desire to want to be part of this mission.

Q. In the same vein, there, I take it to mean that you were never mortal then?

A. I have never been a mortal.

Q. Norson, last week I was in Minneapolis and visited with the Twin Cities study group. The members of that group have indicated that they would like to have a teacher assigned to that group. I indicated that I would communicate back to Welmek, but he's not here, so I would communicate that to you.

A. Understood. We will immediately begin to research this group and to discern what the possibilities are.

Q. Can you give us an update on Welmek's activities?

Q. Is he having a good time?

A. Welmek is having a wonderful time. (laughter) I would rather not comment as you might well understand. It would be more appropriate for my brother Welmek to return and to share with you his joy and what information he can. It would be inappropriate for me to speak for him or to presage what he might wish to say.

Q. If you have communication with Welmek, please let him know that we do miss him.

A. Welmek receives reports on the activities of your group as well as other activities while he is away.

Q. How many active groups are there now?

A. Approximately 45. But you must understand that when you say active what you mean and what we mean may be different. In our view, active means there are beings in a specific area who are assessing and researching the possibility of the assignment of a teacher to a particular group.

Q. Do you forecast, say within a year from now, how many groups there will be?

A. No, I do not wish to do that.

Q. Norson, when we mention Gabriel or Machiventa or Welmek in our prayers to the Father, in positive ways, do you feel this? I mean to say, if I were to mention you particularly in my prayers to the Father, does this filter down to you so to speak?

A. In a way that I simply cannot explain to you, I am aware of such recognitions.

Q. Norson, specifically what things can our Bloomington group do to facilitate contact with a teacher?

A. It would be helpful for your group to pray for a teacher. It would be helpful for the individuals of your group to discuss this mission and the opportunities that having a teacher might provide. In doing so, this may serve to motivate a member of your group to seek to perform the human function that David and Michael perform for this group.

Spacetime

Q. Norson, in the book in the thing on spirit and spiritual reality, it says that "All patterns of reality occupy space on the material levels, but spirit patterns only exist in relation to space; they do not occupy or displace space, neither do they contain it." (118:3.7) So my question is, as a spirit, or do spirit beings occupy space in the same way that we do?

A. The understanding of space and time is very difficult on your world. We could fill this room with literally hundreds of thousands of beings. Time and space are somewhat different than what you experience on your world, but conceptually there is almost no way for you to really understand this. When you pass on from mortal flesh and you awaken on the mansion worlds and you are able to look back upon the world and see mortals, you will immediately sense and better understand the difference in time and space. The explanation in your text is there primarily to help you understand simply that time and space are realities, but there is not enough information in your text to truly bring you to a full realization of our understanding of time and space. This can only occur when you can actually experience it. While it is important to think about these relationships because it will help structure your ways of thinking and help you understand, again, that these are realities, you will experience limitations in your ability to fully comprehend these concepts.

Mansion Worlds

Q. Norson, upon resurrecting on the mansion world, will we miss our loved ones on Urantia that are still here? Will we experience loneliness for them?

A. If you go away on a trip from your loved ones now, do you miss them?

Q. Yes.

A. Do you find that if you are very busy on your trip that you do not think of them as much?

Q. That's true.

A. You will find when you awaken on the mansion worlds that your life will be filled with so many new things that you will be very busy; and you will also know that your loved ones who still remain on Urantia will soon be where you are. So there is a certain sense in which you miss them, but you will be so reassured of their destiny and their fate that you will truly not worry about them. And you will meet many new beings including angels who will be your constant companions. You will rejoice when your loved ones awaken on the mansion worlds; and as you know from your text, when you awaken on the mansion worlds, you are allowed some time to go and visit various loved ones or they can come and visit you. So the answer is yes, but it is a qualified yes. The loneliness that you might experience on this world by being separated from a loved one is often intensified because of your time not being filled and the circumstances which you find yourself in not being very beautiful or positive. Therefore you dwell upon the loved one more than you might in other circumstances, and this increases your intensive feelings, the intensity of your feeling of missing them.

Jesus

Q. Norson, were you present on the planet when Michael lived his bestowal life here?

A. No.

Q. I assume you watched it on universe broadcasts.

A. Yes. The entire local universe was kept abreast of the events of Michael's life. As your text tells you, Michael did not come to live his human life as Jesus of Nazareth just for the mortals of Urantia. (157:6.3)

A. You sometimes think this way, but it simply reflects your limited understanding. Michael lived his life as a human for all the worlds of his entire local universe. They were all made aware in various ways of his life and of his teachings. If you were to re-read his life and you would look at what is said, not only from the standpoint of how a mortal of your planet would view it, but also from the standpoint of how beings from far more advanced planets might also view it, you would increase your understanding of many of the things that Jesus has said.

Q. Can you tell me what, I've never asked a supermortal this question, but in the Urantia Book, in the paper on the apostles, they tell what each apostle thought was the most important thing or the thing that attracted them most to Jesus, or whatever it was that impressed them the most. What impressed you, personally, the most about his life here?

A. I would say his unswerving trust in the Father.

Teacher Contact

Q. Norson, for our Bloomington group you suggested that we pray for the contact of a teacher. Would the form of this prayer be best if it were a supplication or an affirmative prayer? What's the (?) for us?

A. Most effective is that you get together and discuss this teaching mission and how it might help your group. The prayer does not need to be said as a group. Each individual can then go and then pray for the success of this mission and the arrival of a teacher. In this way, we could perhaps more easily discern which of the humans has the strongest desire to perhaps perform the contact role.

Q. As a follow-up question to that, prior to Welmek's announcement or arrival here, this study group had a meeting in which we just meditated. The question is, was there any effect on that meeting to Welmek's arrival, because it seemed like shortly after that meeting is when Welmek made his first contact or at least the first known contact. If that's the case, would Bloomington be advised to do the same?

A. There is value in group prayer and in group meditation, and especially in group worship. To say that the incident that you mentioned was the deciding factor would not be really accurate. It was one of many other factors taken into consideration; but truly the desire of the group and the desire of the individuals within the group is a primary consideration.

Q. Would you distinguish between desire and willingness in this situation?

A. Do you desire to come to this group to listen to these teachings?]

Q. Very much so.

A. Are you willing to serve in the role of the transmitter/receiver?

Q. If that would be best for the group, I would.

A. Do you see the difference, that many may wish to come and listen but not everyone would necessarily wish to serve in the role?

Q. I do.

Barriers

Q. Norson, I have a question. As you were talking tonight about love and the flow of love, I can look back in my past and I understand some experiences differently. I remember a time, for long periods of time, where I felt that I always had those extra little things to give, or that love energy to express to other people. I didn't remember being without that. And I reached a point at which someone was able to point out to me that that could change. I found myself at a loss to understand why that had happened, and I don't think I've come up with the answer still in looking back on that. Can you help me understand what things might have transpired with me?

A. I will address your question only in a general way, not in a specific way. There are many blocks that humans put up. You must remember that God is with you always. His love is with you always. You have access to His guidance and His love. But as young children, you sometimes put all kinds of blocks in the way. You can sometimes be spiteful, you can sometimes be vengeful. There are many undesirable traits that are part of your heritage (tape turned here and some words lost)...there was some block that you finally let go of.

Q. Are you saying that letting go of the block reopens that? You're not saying that letting go of the block shuts that down, you're saying that that's what reopens it?

A. Yes, letting go of the blocks allows the love to flow through you again.

Q. Norson, I have a question along this line. Welmek has said human beings frequently put up subconscious blocks. In other words, they're not aware that their mind has closed off a certain portion or closed off in a certain way. And I would like to know, how can the conscious mind, if the conscious will wants a block removed subconsciously, is it possible to do that?

A. Of course.

Q. How.

A. First, you must try to understand by seeking inner guidance, what it is that is providing the block. You can also, if you sense what this might be, discuss it with your brothers and sisters, ask what they observe that might be the block. If you are given this guidance, and you will be given it if you ask for it, then you can see this block more clearly. This means it has surfaced from the subconscious level. At that point, you may then make a conscious choice. Do you want to continue to use this block, or do you want to let it go?

Q. In the breaking down of the block, though, is it possible that whatever caused that block to come up could be so terrible that that person would have a difficult time facing it and may need someone with more professional status to help that person get through that block? Could it be damaging to the person to remove the block?

A. If a person has a block that stops them from loving themself, from forgiving themself, or loving others or forgiving others, how could it be damaging for them to release it?

Q. Well, maybe the pain of reliving whatever circumstance it was. I'm just wondering if maybe some people need more professional guidance to get through the blocks. For instance, maybe people who are hypnotized and relive a certain part of their life has to then face it and then be able to move past it.

A. There are various techniques by which the removal of such blocks can be facilitated. It must happen within the individual, but certainly others can be helpful in removing this block. Most depends upon the atmosphere, the environment, the love that a person feels from the person who is helping them to remove this block. It is easier to remove the block if you are not in the environment which helped create the block.

Q. Would it be true that people are afraid to remove the block because of the pain that they may experience during that time, even though by removing it it is going to cleanse them. But going through that process is what makes them not want to do it?

A. But is this not just another block?

Q. That's true. That's true.

Divorce

Q. Welmek, I have another question about love in relationships. I'm not sure I have this formulated in my mind, but many times there's an imbalance in love in a relationship. Could that imbalance become so great that that relationship stops to exist, that it doesn't serve a positive purpose?

A. There are many levels and understandings of love. I assume you mean the relationship as between a husband and wife?

Q. Yes.

A. In your text, there is a statement that says divorce must continue to serve as a safety valve for situations that are potentially worse. What do you think that might mean? (83:7.8)

Q. I think it means that there could be potential harm done to both or one of the individuals if the relationship would continue.

A. And if that is the situation, what do you think would be the best thing to do?

Q. To end that situation.

A. Does that answer your question?

Q. I guess, except in my mind I find it hard to discern where that..it's not so clear to me where that line stops and starts because the same thing, we talk about brotherly love and being able to see the person and their understanding and knowing that it's not complete. It's a difficult thing to assess, I think, probably for all of us in certain situations. How do you compare that to that always loving and always being willing to share the Father's love? I guess maybe that distinction now in my mind that's coming right now is a matter of what type of a relationship?

A. If you felt it was necessary to break off a marital relationship with someone, would you wish that person harm?

Q. In my experience, I didn't.

A. Then in a sense, do you still not feel brotherly love for that person? Do you still not hope that God will bless them and that they will have a joyous life and find God within them?

Q. Definitely. In my mind though I wonder was there something more that could have been done. That's what I always search.

A. There is always more that could be done, but it you did not have that understanding or that knowledge at the time, then what else could you have done?

Q. That just seems so sad to me.

A. It is sad, but it is part of the reality of living on an imperfect world, of being an imperfect being. Remember that in the end, you and that former spouse will survive, and will progress, and if it is important for you at some point in your future career you will be able to meet with that person and you will come to more fully understand what happened. And you will be able to forgive each other if that is necessary, and you will leave as best friends.

Q. I believe that's it for the questions. If there are visitors that would like to speak?

Q. Norson, I have a question for someone who requested through Welmek for a teacher. I haven't gotten to speak with her, but she left a message for me. She seemed discouraged. Is there anything that I can do to encourage her?

A. And what is the nature of her discouragement?

Q. I think she's..this is reading between the lines because I haven't spoken to her, but I think that she's fearful that she won't be able to pull together a group to bring a teacher in their (?). I know she's toyed in the past with moving to a location where there was a teacher.

A. This is a decision which she must make. There is no reason to be discouraged. If she truly wishes that, and she truly does the best she can to bring that about, that is all that she can do. She cannot force the situation. Encourage her to have patience, encourage her to do the best she can. Yet, after time, if she does not see any progress in this area, then she must determine how important this is to her life and whether or not she wishes to make such a move.

Closing

Q. Thank you for being with us Norson.

NORSON: It has been my pleasure. This has been my first opportunity to speak with a group such as yours and to have the opportunity to answer questions. There are some visitors who wish to speak briefly with you.

ANDREW: Greetings. This is Andrew. I have addressed you before; and as many of you know, I have been assigned to the group in Pittsburgh. I only wish to say to you tonight that I am pleased with the progress that is being made and that we hope to be on line fully in the near future. I appreciate the opportunity to observe your group. It has been very helpful to me, and I will carry much of what I have learned from your group to my new experience. I wish to thank you for all that you have done to add to my experience. I love you and God be with you. From time to time, I will return and extend my greetings to you. My hope is that at some future time, your group and my group in Pittsburgh will have an opportunity to meet jointly, just as your group did with Oren and the group from Warrenville.

ANDREA: Greetings. This is Andrea.

A. I too wish to echo the sentiments of my brother Andrew. As some of you know, we have had two sessions in the Buffalo group and I am very pleased with the progress. All groups are different and some progress more quickly or more slowly than others. We do not allow this to affect us. Our desire is to work with a group and to move them forward from whatever position they may start from. I, too, would like to thank your group for my opportunity to be a teacher in Buffalo. Your group has been instrumental in spawning some of these new groups, and we are very appreciative of your willingness and your desire to spread this mission. I know you anxiously await Welmek's return, and so do we. I know that the love and the joy that he will return with will be felt by us and also by you. Until that time, go in peace and may God be with each of you.

Materialization

OREN: Greetings. This is Oren. I am visiting your group this evening. I bring greetings from all of the members in the Warrenville group. We continue to progress. We continue to learn, to love and to grow in our understanding. There is an event which I wish to make you aware of this evening. Sometime after the beginning of next year, there will be announced a meeting to which you will be invited. It will be hosted by the Warrenville group. At that time it is our plan to have a Machiventa materialized for you. This will not his permanent assumption of a human body, but will be a temporary materialization. Look forward with great joy and anticipation to this event, and we will provide further details as the time draws closer. Meanwhile practice what your teacher, Welmek, has taught you. Listen and think and pray on the words of Norson and all of these teachers. There is nothing standing in the way of your own spiritual progress but your own doubts and your own blocks. You can grow and you can progress as much as you wish. Go now and await your teacher Welmek's return, and again, practice, practice, practice.

NORSON: This is Norson. I again extend my love to all of you and I encourage you to heed Oren's words. May God be with you, go in peace.