1993-06-01-Anger & Forgiveness

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Teaching buddha small.jpg


Topic: Anger & Forgiveness

Group: Unknown


Teacher: Tarkas

TR: Unknown



Iruka: . ...of God surrounds you, the light of God enfolds you, the power of God protects you. Wherever you are He is, good afternoon, I am Iruka, I am your friend and teacher.



I have missed you in the last two weeks and I look forward to seeing you again today. This group has become very dear to me. I have much affection for you. I feel pain when I see you in pain, and I wish the best for you. I wish the peace from the Father for you, I wish for you to feel His love and feel His joy. Over the last several months we have been doing a lot of talking about the Father's love, how He gives it to you freely, unconditionally, with no strings attached. Hoping that you will accept it, hoping that you will allow it through your whole being. Because it is healing and it will make you feel whole, and with the love comes the peace and the joy. At our last meeting we changed the lesson slightly to forgiveness. I asked you to go through, starting as a child, and forgive everyone that you met. Remember it was not with your emotions, but with your will.

I asked you to repeat to the Father in your quiet time; 'I forgive so and so with my will'. I wanted you to step through everyone from your immediate family members on out to those who you work with and your neighbors. I wanted you to feel how freeing that was, how by forgiving someone else you became free. Actually forgiving someone else helps you more than it does the other person. We talked about acid in a jar hurting the vessel that it was in. By you freeing yourself up of un-forgiveness you are making yourself whole, getting the acid out so to speak. Then as a review, we talked about how the emotion, the anger, and the pain doesn't always leave immediately but it does over time. How simple hurts went away rather quickly where larger hurts stayed with you longer. But they too dissipate over time. And when the hurt comes back just think, whisper, a simple prayer, again I forgive that person with my will, Father, and dismiss it from your mind.

This week I would like to give you a new assignment and that is to forgive yourself. This may seem strange to forgive yourself but if you are critical of yourself, if you do not give yourself approval, then you have probably criticized and rejected yourself. This of course, this lesson is trying to teach you to love yourself. So this week, practice forgiving yourself. Think about what you would say to your best friend. Something as simple as spilling a glass of orange juice; would you say something nasty to that person, to your best friend for spilling it? Probably not, but how often do you think to yourself if you do something, if you call yourself stupid, or dumb. I want you to become aware if you are doing this to yourself and stop. You would not call your best friend dumb or stupid so become your own best friend and if you have to say anything to yourself, say how human, how human to spill that orange juice. Whatever it is you do, forgive yourself and move on, it is human, that is how you were made. And now I will accept questions.


S1: Iruka this is Steve, I don't have a question, but I would like to introduce K1 who is here for the first time.

Iruka: Hello K1, it is nice to have you in the group.

K1: Thank you Iruka, it is nice to speak with you. I just had a lesson in forgiveness yesterday with a psychotherapist. He labeled three doors, one of which was forgiveness and now today I am having the same lesson, which I feel must mean that I really need this lesson. So I thank you for giving it to me yet again.

Iruka: You're welcome, and of course repetition is the best way to learn something.

K1: It is difficult for us as humans not to be hard on ourselves and I do that and I have to stop doing that. That is a very important lesson. I will do my best this week, the coming week to try to put this into action.

Iruka: This lesson is not easy, if you have been doing this and I don't mean just you, but the whole group, as a human being if you have been doing this to yourself for ten, twenty, thirty years, this is not easy to stop doing it overnight. This has become a habit and so it must become a habit to stop. It must become a habit to start forgiving yourself. So look at it as a habit, much like smoking and notice when you are thinking these thoughts and stop them. It will take time, it will be difficult, but the rewards will be great.

K1: Do you believe that replacing bad habits with good ones, which is one of our techniques that we are taught, very traditional methods, is a good technique?

Iruka: Absolutely, because it focuses on something positive rather than on not doing something negative. You focus on the good new habit and it is easier to remember and positive things are always better and uplifting for you. So yes it is an excellent technique.

K1: In my readings of the material from the Urantia Book I remember that Michael always spoke of a positive message, and never talked about things not to do, rather things to do. So I find this to be consistent with what Michael said and I am greatly cheered to make your acquaintance.

Iruka: Excuse me, you will have to speak up a little louder so that I can hear you. I did not hear the last sentence.

K1: [repeated the previous question and statement]

Iruka: Yes, absolutely, and also when I as a teacher was given guidelines we were taught and reinforced that positive works much better, always, from changing your habits to dealing with children to speaking to groups of people. Absolutely.

K1: I was told that there were questions that we could ask and that you may or may not choose to answer them in accordance with your mandate, and I understand that. There is something I am greatly interested in that I would like to speak with you about. If you cannot speak about it I will certainly understand, but I am going to ask you anyway. In 1977 I saw an object in the sky over my house which has fascinated me ever since and I believe, the more I read the book, that what I saw was a seraphic transport and I am wondering if you can in any way within your mandate speak to that issue? Or if you can't I am happy to take whatever answer you give me.

Iruka: It is true I cannot talk about certain subjects and flying saucers are one of them. I am not aware of what you saw that evening but know that one of the goals we have is to make humans more conscious of things that are going around them. How often do you walk down the street thinking about the workday and literally do not see the flowers? And if you don't see the flowers, how can the Father make His presence known to us. So practice being conscious and look around and see what you see and hear what you hear.


K1: Do you believe meditation is a good way to allow the Adjuster to communicate with us? And if so what meditation technique, if there is a difference, would you think would be best for us.

Iruka: Yes, there is. Learning to sit quietly, maybe go through some body relaxation techniques and then clearing your mind and thinking of nothing. Imagining the Father, however you imagine Him, imagine yourself to be in His presence. This is much easier said than done. The hardest part is to relax the mind, but again this is well worth it if you can reach that point where you are sitting in the presence of the Father. You feel the love, you feel the joy, the peace, you feel His total acceptance. This has such a feeling benefit for you in every way, physically, spiritually, emotionally. If you can take even just 10 minutes a day and feel this love, the whole day, your whole life will change. If you can be aware of how much the Father loves you, you can go about your life with this incredible confidence of knowing who you are and knowing who the Father is. Does this help?


K1: Yes it does. What in your opinion is the value, I don't want to over value the intellectual side of reading this material in our book to the detriment of my spiritual connection with the Father as you have just described. But I do find the book to contain fascinating information. I would like to know how to achieve the right balance between the intellectual side of reading this material and the spiritual side of feeling the Father's presence, if there is such a balance to be had.

Iruka: Yes, certainly there is. You can read the book on an intellectual level and keep it there and never get any farther than that, and you have met people who have done this. But the balance of reading the book and spending time with the Father incorporates with each other, integrates, the knowledge, the understanding into your being. Does this help?

K1: Yes.

Iruka: So a balance, both must be balanced.

K1: So that is the right idea. [yes] I am going to turn this over to someone else, I thank you for your time.

W1: Good afternoon Iruka, this is W... again. It has been a while since I had a chance to talk to you. [yes I missed you] How often do you pass through to visit different members of the group Iruka? Outside of meetings.

Iruka: I try at least three times, sometimes as much as five times during the week, depending on my schedule and how things are going.

Teacher Contact

W1: I was curious because you were speaking about forgiveness and I was wondering if you were visiting me when I was questioning whether I wanted to forgive somebody or not. But moving along, I have put in requests for a teacher and I am wondering how much more development do I need before I can expect something to happen.

Iruka: When you request a teacher from the Father, and everyone may have a teacher who wishes one, then there is a time when they are considering who to assign to you. And then the work begins immediately. You are referring to certain circuits in your head, in your brain, in your physical {self}, is that what you are referring to? [yes] Yes, that begins immediately. It doesn't take too long but after you have spent time with the Father, then sit quietly. Now contact will not be attempted while you are spending time with the Father, that is your time with Him and we would not interfere with that or interrupt it in any way. But when you are finished, continue to sit quietly and clear your mind and be aware.

W1: Thank you.

K1: I have had some troubling times recently with my marital state and I need to find a way to forgive and to move on, and the lesson for today is very helpful for me. How am I going to love and trust again after the mistake that I made. I guess I have to forgive myself first, but I don't need to be alone in the world. I know the book says that we are all supposed to raise children to puberty, and if we don't do it here we are given the opportunity on a mansion world nursery. I guess I would like to hear your thoughts on the matter of relationships and child rearing, what steps I might take to set myself right in this area.

Iruka: First you need to straighten yourself out, in other words, learn to love yourself, forgive yourself, understand yourself. While you are learning to do this, feel the love of the Father. Since He already loves you, He already forgives you {and} He already understands you. It is there already, but you have to accept it. So I would say before you can reach out to anyone else, to work on making yourself whole or balanced. It would be very difficult for you to help someone else when you are in pain, when you are hurting. You cannot do it effectively. Much like a swimmer who cannot help another drowning person if he himself is in trouble. He must come to the surface, clear his lungs, get air, stop choking before he can go under and get the other person. Does this analogy help? [yes] Does it answer your question?


K1: Yes, I am curious about your nature, if you don't mind my asking. I notice in the book that some beings...I understand you were once a time space being..that some fuse with their thought adjusters and others do not. I am curious about your particular status in this regard.

Iruka: Your question is, have I fused with my thought adjuster? Yes, I have.

K1: Is that at the conclusion of your mansion world experiences.

Iruka: It was about midway.

K1: That is different for everyone then.

Iruka: Yes it is. Everyone develops and grows at their own speed, and it is not a race. If you have not fused by a certain level there is no ridicule or shame. It is not like getting a D on your report card. There is no condemnation. It is when the being is ready and has grown.

K1: There are stories that I have heard of people disappearing off of our planet. Are these people...is it possible for people in the time space state of being to fuse with their adjusters?

Iruka: Yes and it doesn't happen very often. It hasn't happened very often on this planet, but it has happened occasionally and it is not understood. It has frightened the people around them, they did not know what was happening. On a world that is into life, it happens quite frequently. But here you are not familiar with it so that is why it is scary.


K1: I am concerned about the status of our planet, whether we will make it to light and life. I am concerned about the vast array of armaments and the war-like steps taken by all of our leaders, or at least most of them. And I am concerned about our condition as a people and I am concerned about perhaps the plans that might be in effect to remove us all from this planet. And yet, Michael has said in the book that He will return to this planet. I know you can't make predictions, I have been told that you could not do that, but can you say that there is cause for concern along these lines among us as a people, as a race?

Iruka: Absolutely there are great concerns both on your side and on our side, but we also have great hope and great faith. In no way do we or anybody on this side want this planet destroyed. I am aware that there are groups who think that the planet is near the end. But that certainly is not in any of our plans. We eventually can see and hope for the day that the planet will be in light and life. It will be a struggle, it will be difficult, but we will work for that, that is what we are doing now. One reason....that is one reason why anyone on the planet who wishes a teacher may have one. We are trying to make available to every human being any help that he needs. You see if everybody on the planet knew how much he was loved and felt that love and knew that he was a child of the Father, this planet would be in light and life immediately. So the big job is to tell everybody and have them feel that they are a child of the Father and how much they are loved. Teach them how to love so they can turn around and give this love to everyone around them.

K1: I have a question for you about feeling the Father's love. Jesus I believe, Michael, said that no man knows God except through Him. And I have heard you refer to feeling the Father's love. What role does Michael play in the process of knowing the Father in light of those comments?

Iruka: That is indeed true. No man knows the Father but through Christ Michael. He is for all practical purposes the image of God for this planet. He is the one who commissioned this group that I am a part of to tell you how much you are loved. He is the facilitator, He is the one who wishes everyone to have a teacher or guide or whatever they need to know this. He is working very actively to help this planet.

K1: Is the teacher separate and apart from the adjuster.

Iruka: Absolutely, the adjuster is your image, your piece of the Father who is inside of you. Now a teacher....as a teacher I am a being. I am not inside of you, I accompany you much like your ideas of an angel, how an angel would accompany you. Does this help?

K1: Yes, I would like a teacher.

Iruka: In your time with the Father ask Him for one. He will not refuse you.

K1: I will. In my meditation, my quiet times, do I understand you to say correctly that I should envision myself as being with the Father, or with Christ Michael?

Iruka: Your thought adjuster is a part of the Father. Imagine the Father, you are trying to get to know your thought adjuster so that someday you will fuse with him and become a new creature. At this point imagine whatever you imagine God to be.

K1: I think I understand.

Iruka: It is different for everyone, that is why it is difficult for me to give you an image because that might not fit your picture of God.

K1: I see. When Michael was here He used the imagery to help people of His day and time. Is that correct? [The imagery of?] Christ Michael, to go through Him to the Father. That was a useful tool at that time.

Iruka: Absolutely and it still works. If that makes you comfortable and helps you, certainly use that.

K1: But it isn't a requirement that I go only through Christ Michael. I can feel the Father's presence through the thought adjuster.

Iruka: Absolutely, everyone has a different path. However you get to the Father is unimportant, its that you get to the Father.

K1: I see, that clears up some confusion for me about Christ Michael's statements to that effect. Is He still the system sovereign of Nebadon.

Iruka: Yes.

Second Coming

K1: And He still has plans to come back to our planet.

Iruka: Yes. It does not have to do with time, it has to do with events.

K1: Are those events in any way coming close to fruition now. Can you speak to that?

Iruka: I think what you are asking is...would it be in your lifetime, and at this point it doesn't appear to be. Is that what you are asking?

K1: I think this is what we all would be curious about, what would be happening in our own lifetimes.

Iruka: Although things can change, very suddenly, at this point I would say no, but things can change.

K1: Do I understand correctly, that it is not within your mandate to speak to the issue of visitations to this planet by celestial beings or other types of beings. Is that true?

Iruka: This planet has visitors arriving daily. Is this what you are referring to? [yes] This is an unusual planet. It has had a difficult history, it has unbelievable beauty and there are beings who visit regularly. You are unaware of them but it is very busy by your terms. And not only that but other beings throughout the universe pay attention to what happens here.

K1: Is that because we are known as the world of the cross, according to the book.

Iruka: Partly because you have had so many difficulties and are having difficulties now, and we are trying to turn things around. There is a lot of interest on how this is working and how it is going.

K1: Is the reason that we can't see the beings that visit us because they are outside our range of vision as we are physically endowed at this time. [absolutely]

K1: I have read that there is a major station in Peru in the high mountain elevations. Is this true?

Iruka: A station of..? [beings are coming and going constantly, we don't know where they are from] It is possible. When I was first introduced to this planet I went on a guided tour so to speak. Not only did I see natural, physical things like of course the oceans, the polar caps, things like the Grand Canyon. I also saw things that were human made, tall buildings, beautiful buildings, pyramids....so in Peru there are temples that were made thousands of years ago by Indians. So that is a stop on a tour, do you see why I paused when you said Peru? [yes] How it fits in to the whole planet, but I don't think that is what you are asking. You were asking something else.

K1: I have the feeling that is an important place. My readings have...I have read various reports of the construction of various kinds of temples there that might have been built with extra-terrestrial aid, help from beings other than people who were indigenous to the planet. I have also read reports of there being something like a saucer port, something like we might call an airport on our planet for our own aircraft. And I am wondering if you can confirm such an existence of such a place.

Iruka: Now I understand what you are getting at and no, I am sorry, I cannot refer to that, I cannot answer this question.

K1: That is what I thought. I am very curious about the entire phenomenon because I do, as I say, know what I saw these many years ago and I will never forget it. I believe I saw beings of an extra-terrestrial or angelic nature and why they revealed themselves to me for a short period of time I will always be naturally curious about...I understand why you cannot speak to the issue, but I wish you could.

Iruka: That may be one of the things you have to wait and find out when you get to the other side.

K1: When we go to the mansion worlds, the book says that we will pick up where we left off and no special or additional knowledge will have been imparted to us after passing through the portals of death. Do you agree with that.

Iruka: Yes I do. That is true.

K1: But all things I will find out in good time. Is that true?

Iruka: Yes. Even at my level there are things I do not understand. I am still learning and I will learn for a long time. I am only a little bit above you so know that it will take a long time to get all your questions answered. It is not instant, it takes much learning and growing.


K1: Is curiosity a good element in addition to faith, or can curiosity be taken to far. I am a very curious person. I was trained in journalism. In this life on our planet we have media and that background has made me curious. Is curiosity to be tempered by other factors, or is it OK to be curious.

Iruka: Curiosity has been a gift from the Father. It prevents you from being complacent and accepting things at face value. It is a gift, it is a...enjoy it. That is what makes you seek.

K1: I felt there might be a danger because some of the material in our book says that too rapid progress, gaining knowledge before you should can be detrimental. I think they were talking about enfranchising certain groups of people that there is a drag on it for good reason. Would you characterize your reluctance or your inability to talk about certain of these topics that, that would be the reason for it. Your overseers are not allowing you to tell us things that we are not ready to know yet.

Iruka: There must be a balance. The knowledge balanced with spiritual growth. And as you think of the 20th century, think of your progress, in industry, in technology, where you can do things that you have stopped thinking about their morality. And that is being out of balance, even though you have figured out how to do something, your emotions and your spiritual development has not gone along at the same pace so that you know whether it is right or wrong to have these new techniques or to try these new things. Can you see that being out of balance causes many problems and that is much of it.

K1: Yes I can see that. Can you confirm or speak to the issue of eugenics. I think that no one that currently lives on this planet possess the morality that would be necessary to conduct eugenics experiments and yet we are seeing these kinds of things being done, genetic engineering. Can you confirm that eugenics experimentation are being carried out by beings on our people from elsewhere and how would it fit in with our own experiments. Can you speak to this area.

Iruka: No I am sorry, I can't.


S1: Iruka, do you have a bottom line now, basically a final analysis of what happened in Naperville? Because I am hearing from people who went, and other places that some of the folks who got involved in organizing and orchestrating that were dishonest, unscrupulous, manipulative and basically when I went I was really taken aback by some of the ceremonies and the three concentric circles of swaying dancing people. Was the Planetary Prince really there in spite of all that was going on? If someone should announce something like this again should we fall for it, should we take it at face value.

Iruka: I will address your last question first. That is entirely up to you, whether you wish to go to another place, travel far and see what will happen is of course your decision. To the first part of the question, and of course the most difficult question, anytime humans and their egos get involved in something, things change. The focus changes, the main purpose becomes obscure, personalities get involved, egos with their wants and their needs. And what we had first envisioned certainly changed to what actually happened. I can say that everyone who was promised to be there, were there. They were there. But it did turn out to be something quite different than what we had planned. It has made us step back and re-evaluate what we were trying to do and what happened, what went wrong. Does this help?

S1: Yes it does. Was anything of significance accomplished there, some people were speculating that the Planetary Prince is now in a different form or more available to our planet. Or was it just that he was there? Was anything accomplished at that event, spiritually.


Iruka: Yes there was something accomplished and I am searching for words to describe it. There is more spiritual power available. I have heard the phrase used; the spiritual pilot light was turned up and that accurately describes it. It is not something that you can readily feel, readily notice, but I think what will happen is that people will become more spiritually aware. Maybe just recognize that what they can see and touch and feel isn't the only thing that exists. That there is more beyond and that translates differently to every individual. How they visualize it, how they incorporate that into their being. That is difficult to see. You will not see it on the six o:clock news. But you might detect it in the way people start talking about love, forgiveness. It should become greater parts of their lives. It will be a growing thing. Does this help?

S1: Yes. Is this part of any one of the already established circuits or some mechanism that God or Jesus has already incorporated into this planet. For example God has the thought adjuster the Father fragment within us. Is this amplifying just a component of something that already exists?

Iruka: Yes, essentially, yes, although more circuits are being re-connected. And everything is connected, everything like the human body, what effects one part, effects the other parts. It is like that.

S1: So I can't just reduce it to a single line being amplified.

Iruka: No I don't think so.


S1: Thank you. I keep reading in the Urantia book something that always confuses me. It is something to do with the fact that we are loaned a mind, for the duration of our life on this planet. And I am trying to imagine..I couldn't understand that. I have never been without a mind so I don't know what it means (well maybe). I can't imagine what that means. What does it mean to be loaned a mind. Does it mean that everything I think is already predetermined? Does certain parts of my ability to think about certain things like, I am an engineer by profession, that means those abilities were not genetic but genetically determined but more what God has given me. Can you explain to me what that means, being loaned a mind.

Iruka: I will try. The mind of course is a tool. And you use the tool to think things through, to come to certain conclusions, to understand, to learn, to visualize and it has its limitations. You are aware, you know when you try to think of the Father you know that you are only visualizing a little piece of Him. When you try to think of Him as much bigger, you know it is there but you can't do it. That is an example of the limitation, of course. Then on the other side you will be given a more useful..a mind that will carry you further, that will help you with your logic, with your understanding. Bigger is not a good word, but I don't have another word yet. You will have more imagination. Your mind is fine for your body, for this planet. But it doesn't have a visualization for your spiritual life, or that part of you that is spiritual. So there are limitations. Does this help in some way.

S1: In some way yes, but what you are telling me is like the thought adjuster as a gift from above, the ability to reason and go through things logically from the smallest...since I work with small children now I see this sort of evident in very young children, that is also would you say a gift from the Father.

Iruka: I'm sorry, the mind is a gift.....?

S1: Yeah, the mind, in other words we are born...if the gift of the mind as you say was not present for some bizarre reason... was not given to some child upon birth upon some point of growing up, then that person would not be able to reason and logically solve problems..would...I'm trying to determine if just being...as a human being when you wake up and you grow and develop, you are born, you grow...that the ability to logically solve problems to some degree is inherent in the human being not a gift. That is what I was thinking, but what you are telling me is no, it is a gift from a above and if it weren't there what would we be like?

Iruka: That is difficult to say.

S1: Would we be like Andon and Fonta?

Iruka: But for their time they functioned on the level that they were at. They were growing as much as they could for their level. It doesn't appear that I can explain this in a very satisfactory way and I am sorry.

S1: OK, I guess I will have to wait until I am on the other side to comprehend this.

Iruka: You will have a new mind.


S1: Is it possible..since you said you were fused...is it possible that your advise or whatever you say is..is not possible..its not possible for you to make a mistake because you have fused with the Father.

Iruka: Oh certainly I can make a mistake. I have will, I can still remember something incorrectly, I don't know everything. I can choose to do something...I have will I can choose to do...I can accomplish a task in several different ways and I certainly have the capacity to choose a way that is not the best way. I can still come into conflict with other beings. Certainly I can make mistakes, absolutely.

S1: But your...but I guess being fused with the Father fragment you would know immediately that you are making a mistake, and therefore would not make a mistake.

Iruka: The word mistake is not...it has different meaning to you, lets use a different word. Let us use a different example. You have a task to accomplish, and there may be four ways to accomplish it. None of the four ways are possibly a mistake, they are just different ways of going about it that would have different kinds of influence on various other beings. Some of that influence might not be positive, might not be negative, but might not be as positive at it could be. I might not choose the best way not....in error. Not considering all possibilities.... I'm not sure this is helping either, but mistake is not the right word. I could choose a path that would not be the best and would have consequences that I had not foreseen. Does that help?

S1: Yes, I understand, I think the question might have been for me, would have been better phrased..does fusing with the thought adjuster..fusing with the Father, become a source of constant information within your consciousness. And at this point it may not be even worth it to try to answer this question because if I were to fuse with my thought adjuster I would be translated so it probably doesn't really have that much import to me and so I am willing to let it go right now. [OK] Thank you very much, you are most patient.

K1: Hello, I would like to ask you one more question based on my curiosity. Do you have recollection of your time spent as a being such as us..a time space being.

Iruka: Absolutely. I have many memories.

K1: Were you from a planet similar to this one?

Iruka: Similar in what way?

K1: Were the life forms similar to us?

Iruka: No, not really, there are of course similarities. Walking vertically, with appendages that can manipulate, create machines and manipulate machines, things like that, but I think if you saw a picture you would be surprised and stare.[and stare?] stare. yes. There is enough difference that you would be intrigued.

K1: The book describes to us many types of life forms, two brained, different kinds of capacities for breathing or processing food. I would assume this would give rise to a number of different physical kinds of attributes. What type were you.

Iruka: This is not important. I would like to share with you that I did have a disease when I was on my planet and was quite ill, and I was healed by the Father and I became a minister. So this to me is more important than what I look like, this had more influence on me than anything else. So I would rather share that with you than individual physical attributes.

K1: I understand completely. The book does grant us one very small space to a description of life on another planet. And I guess it is to satisfy human curiosity that it was included in the material. Would you agree?

Iruka: Yes and of course it is always fun to speculate.

K1: That is why we have science fiction literature and films on our planet that are so popular because everybody wants to know. We are curious about other planets, some of us are very curious. But it is the most important thing is not this being the first step, but it is where we go from here and I think I understand that is what you are saying. Is that correct?

Iruka: Yes, of course.

K1: Idle speculation about life on other planets is not going to help me go where I need to go, is that correct?

Iruka: No, we have already discussed what your work is and when you get to the other side that curiosity will be satisfied many times over. As you see the different life forms, they become a source of fascination and intrigue and enjoyment. That God is so creative and so loving and in many ways playful.

K1: When you use the term 'the other side' is that interchangeable with our book's speaking of the so-called portals of death, is that the same experience.

Iruka: After you physically die and go to a Morontia world, yes.


K1: And we will recognize our beings, our friends, by their personalities, is that true?

Iruka: By personalities and also there will be certain traits that stay with you through eternity. That are you, that no one else will have.

K1: What would be an example of a trait.

Iruka: That would be difficult to say, but let me say that when someone else sees you they would know that you are from this solar system, they might know that you are from this planet depending on how much they know, but that you were from Urantia. That certain traits will stay, that is the best I can explain.


K1: At your level, is the function..is there still a function for humor. The book tells us that there are reversion directors on the mansion worlds, and that humor plays a very large role in ascending beings and at some point is no longer needed. When certain spirit levels are attained. At your level is humor still useful.

Iruka: Yes, humor is useful for certain incongruities. And there are still many things that I don't know that I don't understand. And certainly I use it when I work with you.

K1: You use humor to work with us.

Iruka: Absolutely, because it is an important part of your life. And it can be a very effective teaching tool.

K1: The humor that works best is I think...I agree the incongruities of our life, things that simply don't seem to follow a logical course. Humor seems to sort of smooth those spots for us. And you are saying it serves the same function in the mansion worlds. [oh yes, yes]

K1: Are the reversion directors permanently assigned to those positions, are those people who are specialized in this area.

Iruka: It is difficult to use the word permanent when you are talking about eternity, but they stay in them a long time and then others who wish that position are rotated through. Does this answer?

K1: Yes, I am very interested in this area because I love humor, I find that it is one of the things in this lifetime that is very rewarding for me. And I hope I don't have to give it up and I am glad to know through the book that I don't have to. That it will be just better.

Iruka: Yes it is better and it also is a source of healing because it helps to understand why certain things happened or helps you understand yourself. And of course all this happens on the morontia worlds. You continue this quest of understanding yourself and understanding others and so humor is very important.

K1: Would you say the ability to laugh at one's self would be a good trait to foster in an attempt not to take one's self so seriously.

Iruka: Absolutely it is a very healthy trait.

K1: I'm glad to hear that. What would be your way of using humor in helping us, to teach us something which you feel we are not grasping properly. Can you give us an example of how you might employ humor.

Iruka: It certainly breaks tension, and it can draw parallels in certain situations where in one situation its very..its exactly the right thing to do where in another situation its not. And so looking at this can be very humorous.

K1: So the basis of humor in the mansion worlds and beyond remains the same thing as it is on this level of existence. Is that what you are telling me? [absolutely] So as a concept humor is a constant throughout.

Iruka: Yes, most positive things are. Most positive traits are, curiosity stays, love, all the fruit of the spirit, all stay and are only intensified.

K1: Those traits which we would..we have customarily considered to be bad, we would hope to be shedding by the time we go through the mansion worlds, would that be an appropriate way to look at it.

Iruka: Shedding is a good word, yes. Maturing beyond.

K1: Things like anger, jealously, prejudice, things of those nature [absolutely] we would just shed them like a bird might shed his feathers.

Iruka: As an example, if you feel totally loved and accepted and you feel you are a whole balanced person, there is no reason to ever be envious of another being.

Motivation, Mansion Worlds

K1: So the conditions for the emotion of a negative nature would be no longer be there. [yes] That is helpful. Did you go through seven mansion worlds yourself. [yes, absolutely] Do we in traditional ways that we think of time, does it cease to exist when one is going through the mansion worlds. Does it taper off, or does it end suddenly.

Iruka: It generally tapers off because you are used to a time frame, you are used to seasons. And so when there aren't any and there are no deadlines, you do not only have to have a certain amount of time to go through each mansion world, you have all the time you wish, you have eternity. So it is a learned process, you learn not to worry about time.

K1: We have deadlines in our existence which are there for reasons which we all understand because we all need to be prodded to do what needs to be done. Might I infer that on the mansion worlds that curiosity or some form of that serves as the same purpose as our deadlines of time do in this existence. For us to move forward spiritually, to progress.

Iruka: Curiosity plays a part but if you have the goal of getting closer to the Father, of learning whatever it takes on that level, there is motivation besides curiosity to shed the negative and become whole and more positive. Do you see that there are other reasons.

K1: Yes, that is why I asked that question. Because I feel myself out of balance as it were on the side of curiosity. And I may over emphasize its importance and in fact I am a little bit afraid of it sometimes. Because as you know on our planet we have an old saying 'curiosity killed the cat' that an overabundance of anything is an imbalance. That being the case with curiosity, I wonder what functions to motivate us and you answered that, the desire, the honest whole hearted desire to be near the Father, and be like Him. Is that the engine that drives us through the morontia worlds and I believe you have answered yes.

Iruka: Yes, yes you are right.

K1: On our arrival in the mansion world, the book has told us that we would be in a radially arranged area, upon awakening. Is any of the concept presented in the Urantia Book put there to make us understand in our own terms a physical architectural locale of such a nature or is that a convenient fiction for us, to help us visualize what our next incarnation as it were, will be like.

Iruka: It is there to help your understanding, to help you visualize and to not be afraid. One thing to remember is you will never be left alone, you will never be lost, you will be very well taken care of and I think one message that the book wishes for everyone to learn is how much you are loved and how you are taken care of, and that there are places for you, you are guided through. Can you see how this was described to handle any fears of error, of neglect, that a human would be used to on this planet that would not exist on the other side.

K1: Right, that is why my own speculation was that perhaps the description, the physical description of the conditions that we would encounter upon our awaking from the sleep of death as they describe it were put there for that very reason. They aren't necessarily exactly as described.

Iruka: It is as close as possible given the words, given the images that we have to work with.

K1: The handicaps of our language you mean. [absolutely, yes] We don't have words to communicate the conceptual kinds of ideas that the authors are trying to convey to us.

Iruka: Many times we have to use what we have. And that can be limiting. Very much.

K1: Would I be correct in my assumption that it would be outside of the realm of your mandate or your function to provide us with any so called revelatory material. That it is our assignment to have things revealed to us only at our proper pace. Is that why you are unable to talk about certain things.

Iruka: Partially that and the desire not to take the emphasis off what you need to do, what every human needs to do and that is to get closer to the Father.

K1: That is central, we always come back to that.

Iruka: It is like a child who changes the subject so they don't have to deal with what they don't want to deal with. They don't want to go to bed so they think of a hundred things to talk about, so they don't have to go to bed.

K1: That is what we humans do?

Iruka: On a different level, yes.

K1: I can understand that. We really shouldn't have to ask you any more questions than have already been answered then. But I am curious.

Iruka: Of course, I understand your curiosity.

S1: Iruka is Curtis still with me?

Iruka: Yes, yes he is.

S1: Thank you.

Iruka: Do you have any questions about your relationship?

S1: No, I pretty much have been so busy and sort of neglected my relationship with him somewhat, although we are...I believe that he or the thought adjuster has been communicating very well to me. I have done some things that I have always wanted to do to propel the Urantia movement in this area. I started a voice mail bulletin board with another member of this group and I am very excited about that, but with all the other things that I am doing I haven't been communicating with Curtis directly and so I feel like I am accomplishing things but not communicating with him and I just wanted to make sure that he was still with me and hadn't abandoned me for my lack of interest in talking with him and putting it at a high enough priority in my life.

Iruka: He does miss you and miss your communication and looks forward to the day when you resume communication.

S1: Thank you, I will make efforts to correct that. While I was here I felt a very strong presence just a few minutes ago and I thought it was him. And I asked him to tell you something and I was curious if he communicated that message to you.

Iruka: When I give a lesson, I am very busy communicating words to the T/R and trying to understand the questions and think of the most effective answers that will help you. No he didn't because I am very busy when I do this.

S1: Understood, thank you.

K1: Iruka, I have one more additional question for you. I don't know if you know who my wife is, but I feel very sorry for her in her predicament. Do you think she has the strength to get herself through this period and become healthy again.

Iruka: I do not know her personally. I do not know of her but if she wishes to get well, or to get through this she can. It will take some discipline. Other than that I don't know, I am not familiar with this person.

K1: She has a substance abuse problem and I was unaware of it until she finally revealed it to me. And I feel very sorry for her, but I can't do anything to help her.

Iruka: Right now you can only help yourself.


The time is late and the T/R is growing tired so I will close for now. Good evening.

Group: Good evening.