Talk:2022-03-21-NET PMG 27
Among the many objections to Daniel Raphael's work are:
- 1. He cites academic authority using a bogus Ph.D.
- 2. His work parrots Neo Conservative US foreign policy. NEC 7NEC 8
- 3. He cites the Rothschild family as a model of social sustainability. NEC 9
- 4. He has spiritual beings citing the amorality of their protocols.NEC 20
- 5. He cites the virtue of commercial AI to guide moral decisions.NET 53
- 6. In recent years, he has referred to himself in capital letters as "This One".
- 7. One of the members of this group is assigned "to invent a new religion". NET 96
- 8. He has Machiventa stating in March 2020 the Covid virus "is a natural occurrence". NET 86
2022-03-21, New Era Transitions Planetary Manager’s Group #27, Machiventa
Machiventa Melchizedek, Planetary Manager Topics:
Crises and cataclysms A new way forward Competent cooperation Values and principles of decision-making Preventing a second global civilizational collapse Do it for the children You are all connected What have you done lately for your world? Rules of decision-making The rules of decision-making have benefits attached Your democratic societies are spineless Arc of the Teaching Mission You must protect your society Abuse in families Family associations (like Homeowner Associations) The future is geared toward assisting societies mature and evolve Softening the transition for others to the mansion world Have you ever felt peace? Human free will Removing predators from your society Is there no place for empathy? Role of Ancients of Days No death penalty, only removal Your program of incapacitation by incarceration is unsustainable Leave rehabilitation to the Mansion Worlds Influencing at a distance You are developing great soul-value
TR: Daniel Raphael, PhD
Crises and cataclysms
Daniel: I don't have a clue of what he's going to talk about, so we go freelance today.
Machiventa: Good morning, this is Machiventa Melchizedek, your mentor and your planetary manager. It is a pleasure to be here and thank you for your presence as well. As you can see in your world, in the space of two weeks your world has changed incredibly. If you are an historian who observes the long arc of history, of nations, cultures, and civilizations, you are noting that the crises and cataclysms we had mentioned are keeping pace and developing as we had predicted. It's not that we want this to occur, certainly not! As we've said many times before, this is the result of human decision-making, and as you can see from the assault, the invasion of Ukraine, this has to do with one person’s maniacal expressions of homicide against humanity. This is a development which will be noted in the future [to have been] as devastating to your world and civilization as was the Holocaust, World War II, and the other one is the dropping of the atomic bombs on the two cities in Japan. It will be noted simply because this marks the deepest depths of moral depravity that has occurred in the last many decades. This is the depth of human aggression, human egoism, and narcissism.
This is a mark along the pathway of the future of humanity. This is one of those milestones which only occurs every 50 years or so, and it is our intention that this will be the last one. It will be one in which all other future events of human depravity will be measured. It will be a development of which humanity will do all that it can to move away from and to aspire to the higher goodness that is innate (yes, innate) to humankind. Humankind is genetically by disposition peaceful, sociable, and even benevolent. The difficulties of your world have caused many to be aggressive as they have forgotten the factor of equality in their own life against that of others—they being more equal than anyone else. And so, they express their hostility against others for their own well-being. If you use this as the very most-depraved depths of human behavior, then there is much room for improvement. And not so oddly, this is the development of the making of your traditional civilization—of the competitive process of business, [the] competitive process of gamesmanship, and of war. This is competition that is perverse. There are certain aspects of your humanity—of you being a human—[where] aggression is useful. It is also a defensive mechanism. However, in the development of your civilization there are some of these traits which have outworn their usefulness and are totally inappropriate now.
A new way forward
It is now time for individuals, families, communities, societies, nations, cities, states, and so on to consciously make decisions with an intention in mind to find a new way forward. Secondly, it is important that humanity—your nations, civilization, and cultures—give up this dithering about finding your own place, getting what is yours, and getting along with others so you can get an advantage. The separation is more than a penchant; it is a separateness and personal isolation—individualization, individualism—are working against the good of all humanity.
If we simplify this equation of action by individuals, you'll see also that individuals have a social gathering as well. The morality and ethics that have been used historically have sustained the separateness as long as you don't hurt anyone else. The separateness must give way in this new era for the working together of competent cooperation—where it is not enough just to sustain your societies, your social environment—it is now necessary to sustain the social environment of everyone [so] that everyone has a stake in their survival. It is now past time and finally due that individuals, organizations, governments, corporations, any entity that has an organization (even a sole proprietorship) has intentions to work for the greater good of the survival and organizational existence of your societies.
Values and principles of decision-making
If you look back over the last 20,000 years of the organizational existence of the nations, empires, and cultures from villages that have a city council or town council clear up to international organizations, in the last 20,000 years they have all failed. That is simply because the organizational matrix that holds your nations together (individually and collectively) have not used the values and priorities of decision-making to sustain their existence. Now, that's a very simple sentence, isn't it? They haven't used the values and decision-making processes and priorities to sustain their own existence. You should be asking yourself: Well, what is wrong with this equation? What is going on that our societies fall apart and fail? And the answer is that they do use a uniform code of ethics and morality that is based on universal and timeless values. Even though there are traditional ethics and morality which have no valid base of timeless and universal values, nonetheless, the organizational structures of your societies have failed during those millennia. This requires a new thought—a new intention for existence. Besides the survival of yourself individually and your family, you must also have an intention to sustain the social matrix and the organizational matrix of your societies, and not for just one individual or one foundation, but for all organizations to have an intention to sustain the organizational existence of your societies.
Preventing a second global civilizational collapse
This One complains about the complexity of what he has been writing with Avahlah, and this is what we want to leave with you: that that last sentence I gave you has intentions, complexities, and perspectives which are far beyond most people's thoughts. And my friends, it will require every one of you and every one of your organizations to sustain your civilization in the future so there does not occur a second global collapse—global, civilizational collapse. And it is not the individuals that will collapse, it is your organizational matrix that will collapse. How do you do “business” as a society without organizations? Well, simply stated, you don't! You end up with a population living unto itself back in the eras of villages, home crafts, and such. Organizations empower individuals and groups of individuals to accomplish things that they could not do alone or even together. There must be an organization of united effort to accomplish larger ends and large remains. Now, if you would project that to a civilization (by that I mean a survivable and sustainable civilization) it will require everyone to have the same intention for their lives to sustain the ongoing organizational structure and matrix of their states, cities, and nations working together as an association of national organizations to accomplish the larger result of global sustainability.
Do it for the children
Now, I know it has dawned on some of you here—an individual or two is saying: “Ah-ha! So that's what he's been talking about all these years.” Yes, my friends, that is what we have been talking about all these years. And it is not that this survival of your global civilization takes the prime priority of your life, but that this will always be a constant aspect of your thinking for the future. Now, most of you have children and grandchildren—some of whom you love dearly; others, you don't. [chuckling] There are difficult individuals who have become born as well, as you know. And so, you love these children and grandchildren dearly and you would do almost anything and everything for them, but now we are talking about generational care and sustainability, where you, now this elder generation and generations that are younger, are taking efforts to sustain the quality of life of your great-great-grand-children's future generations.
Some of you have lived your lives as though this generation is the most important. We recently overheard a conversation where the highest aspiration that this couple had was to join the local country club in Paradise Valley, Arizona. That was their highest aspiration. That's desperate, my friends—seeking to be accepted in a larger community without thinking about your grandchildren, great-grandchildren and so on, having a life that can accept their children's lives as being beneficial to everyone. So, we have broadened the horizon from the two or three degrees of the arc forward in your lives to at least 180 degrees if not 270 degrees in the arc of a circle of your lives going forward.
You are all connected
You are acquainted with the term “six degrees of separation”: six times over you know someone who knows someone who knows someone, who knows someone who knows Kevin Bacon. (That's where it all started.) And so, everyone is connected. If you were at a conference in Honolulu, you know someone who knows someone who knows someone who knows your publisher and your editor for instance, and so on it goes. Your children know those cousins of theirs that they've never met. The point is that you're all connected, and that you can make repercussions in your lives now, which will repercuss for generations ahead. Now, when you think backwards, all of you (most of you weren't born here as indigenous individuals of this continent) had some ancestors who came from another country. It was their aspirations, their desires, that they have a new sense of freedom and accomplishment in their own lives, but, almost to every one of them, they wished for something better for their children. And so, they did that—they made tremendous sacrifices, saved their money, started businesses, and expanded their businesses to have an income to support their children to go to a local college, or maybe a prestigious college and university, and supported their children to do so.
What have you done lately for your world?
It's not that I'm going to put a guilt trip on you and say: “What have you done lately for your world, children.” It comes down to something like that. “What are you doing to assist the future generations to live quietly and at peace, sustainably, with the quality of life and living equal or better to your own?” Well, as you know, I'm baiting you. Some of you have already thought ahead to what I'm doing, and you realize that I am soliciting individuals to assist us to bring about the new era and its greatness and grandness—where you make decisions today to design the future of what your children will enjoy. Thank you.
Rules of decision-making
Jeff: Good morning Machiventa. You’re in a cheerful mood considering how dark our world has turned in two weeks, and I certainly appreciate your message. In the last session, in your introduction, you mentioned “rules of decision-making.” You mentioned Avahlah and Daniel, and in your benediction, you said, “We're encouraging you to make good decisions and know the ‘rules of decision-making’ to assist yourself to be a good person.” My first reaction to that was to look up the phrase “rules of decision-making” in the NET PMG papers, and I found no match. My second reaction was to look at the social sustainability design and valuation schematic, which I have tried to use here, and in Palm Springs to review the single use ordinance on plastics in public places. And I didn't find in that any “rules” that I can associate [with that.] I can see that you can tick off the boxes, go through the matrix, and make sure that everything aligns with that. Can you straighten me out on this about what are the rules? Can you point me in the right direction perhaps?
MM: Certainly. As you know, every culture has its own set of values at its core, and from these values in the culture, you'll [also find] attitudes and perspectives of that culture. Well, in a culture of humanity, there are the values that are innate to each person— those seven values of life, equality, growth, quality of life, empathy, compassion, and a generalized love for humanity. Now, every organization that you personally have ever participated in, Jeff, has a set of rules, and it's called the code of ethics. For accounting and financial firms, they often have their own in-house set of rules for making decisions. And as financial managers have associations and organizations of financial managers, they too have a set of codes, a set of values that, when they are adhered to, the individual financial manager will not run afoul of the law or do something unethical or immoral with their clients’ money, their financial assets, and other forms of conveyance.
So those values are used in every culture to develop a code of ethics and morality. These are the rules of decision-making. This has been discussed in several of This One’s books on ethics and morality, and lately in the last one—the recovery book—and several others. It hasn't been pronounced, but at this time, we are definitely making that pronounced. The rules of decision-making for the future and for all time will need to be used in order to achieve peace, social stability, and for those of you who read The Urantia Book to achieve the Days of Light and Life. The downside of that, for this current generation which is oriented to the traditional me-ism, and “I'll get mine,” separation, and so on, is that you have to give that up. Violations that disrupt social stability and peace are unethical and immoral in the new era.
Now, when you take that fact alone, only that, you can see across the board and how you (and I mean the larger you, Jeff, meaning your civilization and all humanity) do business today, that it is going to cause a cognitive dissonance of profound proportions. How do you do business in the future? Being morally right, ethically fair, and still make a living? Well, if you are designing a future socially sustainable society, as This One and Avahlah are doing now, you would realize that something has to give. And the give comes in with those high standards of social comparison, okay?
The social comparisons are dangerous, they lead to tremendous wrong decisions, greed, avarice, a lack of compassion, a lack of empathy, and so on in some people. In some [others] we've seen where multi-millionaires are assisting others to have a better life through peaceful means. It means that, in the future, rather than being paid millions of dollars a year for your salary and your work, you would be paid far less than that. It also means that instead of aspiring to own a Rolls Royce, a Bugatti of some sort, or other cars that cost more than a million dollars, you would be most satisfied to have one that costs less than $70,000 in today's equivalent monies. In other words, the comparative standard of living, quality of life, (which is a falsehood based on comparative increasing costly items) is a grand hoax upon all of humanity across the world. It is one thing to have a great quantity of life, but it is another to have a great quality of life. Now, would you rather have 100 grandchildren that you give gifts to every Christmas, or would you rather just have one or two grandchildren who you adore, love, and have personal time with, and who love to work outside in the garden with you, or work with grandma in the kitchen making cookies that they'll have in the afternoon. The measurements of a life of quality in the future is quality oriented, and so it is the quality value of life that is emphasized rather than the quantity object emphasis of your current generations.
You must have a sound, reasonable, and conscientious, stable set of values that will last all time to guide decision-making to fulfill that. That's probably more of an earful than you asked for Jeff, but this will answer many questions for you. Thank you.
Jeff: Well, thank you. If I may follow along with a slightly different question regarding your answer to me. It seems like in our current society (and I can only speak for the country I live in) ethical violation of such rules are not equally applied, and there are people who are serial breakers of not just the law, but of the standards that they have signed on to for their own industry. And I don't have any idea how society can construct a discipline that says “If you do not follow the rules, there are consequences for your status in our society, your status in your community, and your status in your family. Can you speak to that at all?
The rules of decision-making have benefits attached
MM: Gladly, thank you. First, the ethical and moral decision-making tools are backed up by the seven values. So, when you see inequality in the workplace where there are violators of in-house ethics, as you mentioned for instance, they are treating themselves unequally compared to others, and they do not mind violating those standards.
Now to go to the second part of your statement. The rules of decision-making do not have penalties attached to them, they have benefits attached to them. And when you follow these rules, these good things will happen for yourself and for others. This is a positive decision-making process where there are no prescriptive statutes saying that if you do this, then such and such will occur, and you will be penalized. In the new era there will be people who will violate those in-house rules (the rules of society), those who are predators in-house, out of house, or in society, who violate the rules that benefit everyone. This is where the backbones of your societies need to be poured in concrete rather than being so lenient and complacent to accept variations of behavior between individuals and individuals in society. Those individuals would be harshly dealt with. And the penalties would be so severe [that] individuals would not want to violate them and would want to comply with the proactive, wonderful benefits that accrue to good decision-making.
Your democratic societies are spineless
I have used this kind of language in past sessions; I have said that your democratic societies are virtually spineless. They are weak-willed and have no character. And, as they exist, they are not worthy of being sustained to survive… except for the fact that democratic societies are the best place for people to express and develop their innate potential. And we've expressed that before in the past. So, on the one hand good government provides opportunities for growth of individuals. On the other hand, those individuals who violate the forward momentum of society for the good of all are severely dealt with without exception. And there would be no mitigating circumstances. So, your question is loaded, and the answers are very clear to us. It is our wish—our duty—to prepare you for the best future that you could possibly develop on your own and with us. And that is why we are here today with you speaking about these things to assist you in being the founders of the new era of democracies that will develop.
Arc of the Teaching Mission
As you old-timers in the teaching mission may recall, we began very softly, very slowly, and very gently so as not to shock you—as not to dissuade you from listening to these sessions anymore. And now we have come to a place where we are speaking to you as a grandfather or grandmother would to the misbehaving children in the house. What you are about to face in the world as the crescendo of this grand orchestra of humanity, as crises and cataclysms reach their peak, is to prepare you for the harsh realities that you've never had to face before. What you are looking at, [to use] a phrase that Avahlah and This One used, is the crushing destruction of your societies. And those who remain will gather up the pieces, the plans, and the intentions for creating a sustainable world. We do not need to overly paint a severe future for you because the realities of the future will do that for you and for us. We simply want you to be prepared to gather up those pieces, as there will be many of you who remain who know what we're talking about and know that stability does not come from the precarious house of cards of violation of ethics and morality, compassion, and empathy for others. Those violations must be done with. There will come a time when you will be as stern as we are, where you will see the duties of your leadership (as you will be a leader) of enforcing the goodness that governance can provide to individuals, families, and communities, but also have the responsibility of swiftly and surely dispatching those who violate the core tenets of sustainability and survivorship of your societies, organizationally.
You must protect your society
You have the laws in place for protecting individuals. On the other hand, you do have some regulations that protect individuals from organizations, but there is no one who is really concerned about the organizational survivorship in an ethical and moral way. You have two responsibilities in the future. One is to sustain and retain capable and competent individuals who are ethical, moral, and who are and have proven themselves to be good parents and good providers in their community. The other responsibility is to protect your society—even when it becomes very difficult, and much opposition comes your way for doing so. Society is a collaboration of organizations to get along, to sustain your survival. Now, we are going to reinvent organizations within each social institution as being actionable to take partial responsibility for sustaining and directing life and living within their own organizations for the good of humanity and the sustainability of your societies. This is completely new. Émile Durkheim did not define social institutions that way. We are now taking the opportunity with you to do that for the good of humanity. Thank you.
Abuse in families
Jeff: The vision that comes into my mind, Machiventa, is a 21st century movement, like the Women's Temperance movement that really shook up many of the abuses of the 19th century. The women got their backs up and said “enough.” And you're suggesting that that is something that may be brewing in our future.
MM: My friend, it is definitely brewing in the present and the future. We are making those plans by which the evils, as alcohol was called at that time, of abuse mandatorily require their rectification and their elimination. We give you only one single area of abuse, and that is the abuse that occurs in families. The most egregious of which are incest and abuse against children, wives, spouses, partners, physically to point to them being put in the hospital. In the future that is intolerable, unacceptable, and is the cutting edge of whether that individual—the perpetrator, predator—remains in society or is removed. When you have predators inside a family organization causing multi-generational damage to the immediate victim, the victims around them vicariously, and to future generations by the replication of predatory behavior by those people who were victims, then you have a situation that is totally immoral and is the reason for much of the moral degradation and depravity of your societies now. In the future, you will either support and sustain the benefit of society in a larger context or you will not. If you do not, the great degree of your predatory behavior will determine how you are treated by the courts or by the adjudicating authority.
The penalties for violating the forward movement of social evolution and the good of all people, the violation of social stability and sustainability is intolerable, unacceptable, and it must cease. As you know, we do not carry the sword of Solonia. We are not here to adjudicate those individuals, we are here to advise you and to assist you in living a life and developing a society, beginning with the family, that contributes to the welfare and good of all concerned whether immediately in your community or across the continents and across the world.
Family associations (like Homeowner Associations)
You, as individuals, will be the ones who will design the future communities and the statutes of living in a peaceful, socially stable community. You have what you call HOA’s—homeowner associations. In the future, you will have family associations where there will be individuals who monitor the welfare of each family, and they will be seeing to the good that occurs within families and assist families in establishing patterns of raising children that are beneficial and genuinely good for the good of their child's soul that is developing for, in the future. These children will become your leaders, whether they are elected, appointed, or determined by themselves and by others.
Now, [if] you project what I have been talking about—the degradation of families and so on and predatorship—you will now see why your leadership is so deficient in its duties now, and you see in the predatory actions of the invader of Ukraine where this person has come from. The environment that they learn from, the models that they were exposed to and learned and inscribed in their hearts and their minds forever. That is so desperate. That is so opposite of the goodness that Christ Michael wants for you and for all future generations. You, with us and the plans that we're developing, will develop a world that is worthy of His return. And as you could see from your world around you by the many shootings that are occurring over petty incidents and squabbles and the harm that is occurring in families, communities, and so on that your world has tremendous work to do. And children, it is not going to be easy. It is not going to be pleasant. It is not going to be agreeable to your higher mind itself. Some of you will be required to carry out the functions of maintaining a stable society. I don't need to describe that to you. You know what removal entails, and so on. You, on the other hand, will need to develop these statutes and the penalties that are beneficial to the individual and to society when they are carried out.
The future is geared toward assisting societies mature and evolve
You see, everything in the future is geared toward assisting society to mature, to evolve, and to grow, and that all activities, all behaviors, all attitudes, and all values that work against that are to be eliminated and removed. If you start with behaviors (which are actions) and work backwards, then you realize that people are talking about what they want to do and what they will do. And when you're not aware, you know that they are thinking the same thing, and their thinking is based on a set of values and behaviors that were patterned in their lives beforehand. So, this work that we have in front of us minimally will take two generations or 50 years before it makes a difference. The difference that will truly make a difference to all of humanity is the desperately dangerous cataclysms and crises that are occurring, will occur, multiply, and increase in intensity. And in the end, some of your societies will surely be crushed and they will have no way of knowing how to recover. Hopefully someone will keep on hand the plans that we have shared with you, are sharing with you, and are now developing. I apologize to you, Jeff, personally, for the harshness of my replies to your innocent questions, and I appreciate what you've done for the good of all. Thank you.
Jeff: Well, Machiventa, you need to give me no apology whatsoever. And the truth is not harsh. It is the truth, and that seems to be very much lacking in so many parts of our civil society. The truth is the truth, and it stands by itself, and I can't thank you enough for telling the truth. Thank you.
MM: You're most welcome. And remember that the truth is now based on the standards—universal and timeless standards—of the values that each Homo-sapien individual carries with them and are ingrained and embedded in your genetic structure. These are the determiners of truth; that and the rules of decision-making that emanate from those values. Thank you.
Walt: Thank you so much, Machiventa for being with us today. Although I have questions, I have to give a reaction to what you have said, and I have to join with Jeff in saying, thank you so very much especially for the depth and detail and really giving us clarity on the nature of where we are and what it's going to take for us to get where we need to be. I don't want to use the word encourage, but I really welcome anything that you want to share with us no matter how heavy it may be. We need to know this; we need to be constantly reminded and refreshed of the seriousness of the situation so that we maintain our determination to contribute in a way that will usher in that more sustainable society. So, thank you so much.
Softening the transition for others to the mansion world
My first question: Is there a prayer that we can use to either soften the transition of those who are crossing over and to shorten the time for healing of those who have already crossed over?
MM: Yes, most assuredly you can. And the first is to reinforce the God connection between the individual and the God presence within them whether they live in this lifetime, whether they are on death’s bed, or whether they have already crossed over. And particularly that is useful for those who have crossed over and who are the sleeping survivors and those who have recently entered the morontial realm where they will progress and go to classes and so on. You would be praying for their right decision-making concerning the course of their soul and their infinite ascendant journey to paradise. I say these things in general terms because how you put them in your own words is your business, and so on. It is the sentiment of your heart and your message that is most important, and your sincerity is above all a requisite necessity for effective prayers and meditation. Thank you.
Walt: Thank you so much, Machiventa. You use the phrase “reinforce the God connection.” Could you explain what you mean by that please? How do we assess these to reinforce their God connection? That's what I meant.
MM: Walt, it has to do with the sincerity of your heart and your quest. If you are unable to achieve that, then you have no knowledge in a way of appealing to God, the Spirit of Truth, Christ Michael, or their guardian to assist that individual. Your sincere concern for the one you're praying for is very important. We're not asking you to tell God what to do. We're asking you to tell yourself how to do it. Thank you.
Walt: Okay, that's helpful. Thank you too. And I also wish to ask what prayer, meditation, and visualization we can employ when [engaged?] to wage peace in an active conflict zone to overcome the destructive will of one or more humans.
Have you ever felt peace?
MM: Yes, certainly. I have a clear answer for you. Have you ever felt peace?
Walt: Well, yes, yes, indeed.
MM: So, you know how that feels?
MM: Yes. And now I've shared with you how to project the energy from yourself to all humankind. Do you remember that?
Walt: Not specifically, I'm sorry.
MM: Well, you didn't pass that test. [I’m] bringing some levity here after all the serious talk. You'll find that in the former text. You radiate this joy of peace that you have within you to an individual, a situation, or to the whole world. And you do not need to tell people what that feels like because they know it. And when they feel that inspiration that what you want is the vicarious response in those to whom you project this, to have a vicarious response to the joy that you are expressing. And once they feel that they will never forget it. It is the same sort of recognition when you speak to some child that is lost or some adult who is lost, and you say: “You know what home is like, don’t you—the home you'd want to be in?” And they would say: “Yes.” And you'd say: “This is what you want to return to. You want to return to peace. You want to return to the joy of peace, the satisfaction, the fulfilment of peace, the engagement of peace.
And so, this is the home that you want in your heart, and you send that out to all humankind. Thank you for your question.
Walt: Oh man, that’s delicious. Thank you, thank you so much for taking that time and the beauty of the answer. Thank you. And the next question is: In terms of democratic public policy making, how appropriate, feasible, and effective could it be for government or governments to commission multiple independent polling institutions to determine the will of the people on social matters in order to guide policy decision-making?
MM: You speak of two issues. One is balloting and policy generation, and [the other is] from appointed, independent government agencies. You obviously must realize that there is an inherent conflict of interest between these parts of your question. What you're really seeking, if I read you correctly, is that you want an independent appraisal, of voting, polling, ballot counting, and so on down the line. That is independent of…
Walt: I’m so sorry. That’s not it exactly. What I'm really trying to figure out is the best way to drive public policy decision-making where you get the best representative desire of the masses on specific policies.
MM: Oh, thank you for the clarification of your question. In truth, my friend, it is your problem and your answers to seek. Thank you.
Human free will
Walt: Okay, understood, understood. And the last question is: What is it about the [nascent?] identity of the human that makes its will so sacrosanct and seemingly inviolable to your team.
MM: [Chuckling]This is Machiventa. Thank you so much for your question. That is very insightful. And the answer is very simple: There are rules of etiquette, rules of ethics, and rules of ascension morality, that hold mortal decision-making as totally sovereign for all time and for all eternity. So, there are values, literal values of a soul, which are so sacrosanct, so important, so crucial to the ascension of the individual, and the ascension plan of all individuals that violation of any of the sovereign decisions of mortals would be tantamount to treason. Thank you.
Walt: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much. That will do it for me now. Thank you.
Removing predators from your society
Marthe: Thank you so much for the sternness today, Machiventa. I really enjoy listening to the previous answer, but I want to go back to the sternness. When you say that we have to dispatch predators who violate rules of ethical and moral decision-making I understand what you're saying, but it almost seems to other people that one is going back a thousand years when people were dispatched at the will of others in power. And in the country I live in, people had, through a lot of co-creative decision-making, decided against that kind of capital punishment. And so, I want to understand the gentle decision-making of people who say we have ways of healing people. And I know... I guess my question is...
Daniel: Keep it simple.
Marthe: Yes, I guess my question is just how do we... So, there's a very stern answer that says: these people are violating what you've just spoken about—the sacred decision-making of souls, but it also means it seems like we're going back a thousand years. How do you describe to people that this is a different way of dispatching people than what our very crude human history has exposed us to? Thank you.
MM: Thank you. In other words, you're seeking the rationale and justification for dispatching individuals who violate the progressive movement of societies forward in its maturity and evolution, correct?
MM: Thank you. Then my question to you and to anyone who would say that this is a step backwards, 1000 or 2000 years, I would ask this question of them: Well, how would you maintain the forward movement of societies and nations? You see, no one's in charge of maintaining your society. No one is seeking to fulfill or have written out the procedures for maintaining the advancement of social maturity, social evolution, and increasing the good of all concerned. There is no manual for that. And one of the lessons that humanity has to learn is how to maintain its peace. Now, the individual is ultimately responsible for their behavior, not society. So, if the individual is unwilling to correct their behavior, their thoughts, their values, their selfishness, then who will? And how would you do that for a nation of a million people, 250 million people, a billion people? How would you do it for the earth? How would you do that?
Marthe: Thank you so much Machiventa.
MM: You're welcome. Who is going to do that? Then it has to fall upon the shoulders of your association of individuals called communities, cities, or some jurisdiction to do that, and the rules for doing that have to be fair, have to be unequivocal, cannot be amended, cannot be given allowance to special individuals, but must be exercised fairly for all concerned. This is the difficulty of the transition era that will last for the next, let's say, 500 years until the advent of the Days of Light and Life. We must first seek peace. And before that, we must seek social stability, and the criterion for social stability is not violating social stability, and then have a clear idea of what causes instability and the eventual degradation and deterioration of your societies so that they implode. Thank you.
Is there no place for empathy? Role of Ancients of Days
Marthe: Thank you so much, Machiventa. May I ask one last question then? So many people have had a catastrophic loss of family—people who end up destitute and as possible predators. How then do we measure that lack of chance that they had to develop their souls, when so many of us have had so many better examples of parenting? I mean it just seems an incredible loss to people who've become predators because of that catastrophic loss of care and nurturing as children. And so, I guess I'm just asking: Is there no place for empathy and is there any way to heal people who've been so deprived of good parenting. Thank you, Machiventa.
MM: For the first instance of your question, it is the Ancients of Days who will take all of that into account. As far as healing those people who have been desperately injured by trauma in their life, it has almost never occurred that they're healed thoroughly and totally. There are still remnants of such trauma in their lives. Now the opportunity to heal themselves by outside assistance is principally due now to the lack thereof, and that they are victims or the circumstances of the immaturity of your societies and your cultures. These individuals must do as best they can in their lives. The weighing of souls in the end is done by an adjudicating authority that I have mentioned which has the insight into the totality of the individual's life and all circumstances. And they are given fair and sure consideration for the difficulties of their life and the lack of modeling that they had when they were children, infants, and so on. And they, as an individual, had the eventual choice to make a choice or not. The unfortunate thing about your populace is that many do not have the knowledge and awareness to make that choice for themselves for the betterment of their souls. This too is part of the immaturity and degradation of your social standards and mores. It is important that we do all we can, and you do all you can to assist your societies to move forward in its maturity and its social evolution. We account that, through the morals and ethics that you have and how people abide by them, and how agencies abide by them, and how organizations abide by them, and whether your agencies, governments, and organizations seek to improve the condition of humanity in their own stead, in their own care, in their own area of responsibility. This is how the advancement of the maturity of your societies is weighed by us. Thank you.
Marthe: Thank you so much.
Recca: Thank you for the opportunity to ask a question today Machiventa. My mind leaps (as usual) to the end point of our emerging societies protecting themselves against individual predators, not only within the family, but in the social arena and in the economic arena. From what I've heard from the excellent questions given to you today and your responses to them, I wonder if we need, as an emerging society, to install a version of capital punishment for the perpetrators of social crime and economic crime to reduce an individual or a corporate circumstance to zero or to maintenance levels as a punishment for their actions that debilitate the progress of society?
No death penalty, only removal
MM: Yes, of course. Any decision-making, any actions that retard the forward movement of society, whether it is committed by an individual, by a dyad, several individuals, a gang, a corporation, or a sole proprietorship that retards the progressive movement of society forward would be treated in a way that would be commensurate to their offense. The most egregious financial and fiduciary crimes would, of course, entail removal.
For clarity’s sake, this is not a penalty. This is not a punishment. This is not a desperate move by society. There is no death penalty, there is simply removal. There are no euphemisms surrounding this removal process. It is what it is. It is commensurate to the offense that is committed. If it is the egregious loansharking percentages that are charged by financial institutions similar to those loan sharks on the street, those individuals who would be responsible for that, even to the corporate board of directors, would be dealt with commensurately. The individuals who make these decisions cannot hide behind corporate policies, cannot hide behind corporate boards, whether it is three people on the board or whether it's 30 people on a board. All are equally responsible for the behavior of the individuals at the line level, at the community level, at the individual level. This is much as President Harry Truman said about responsibilities. He said, “The buck stops here.” You can't pass the buck in eternity, you can't pass the buck and be socially responsible to the forward movement, progress, evolution, and maturity of society. Any actions that work against that are punishable—to use your word. Thank you.
Recca: Thank you and let me just clarify from my side. I did not mean the removal of life at all, simply the removal of the opportunity for further action by an unethical person.
Your program of incapacitation by incarceration is unsustainable
MM: This is Machiventa. Again, we say that incapacitation of an individual who has accomplished egregious acts that harm society, an individual, a family, a community would be removed. And we mean permanently removed; that their life would be removed, and they would be sent on their way—joyously. The incapacitation that your societies now use—incarceration—is unsustainable, it is inequitable, it is not fair, it is inhumane and works against the seven values of each individual who is incarcerated. We have given reasons for those statements before, and they still hold. Thank you.
Recca: Thank you. Then can I assume that the mansion world reeducation and improvement is our reason for dispatching [them.] But to rehabilitate here on Urantia is not necessarily society’s responsibility—that that rehabilitation of choice will happen on the first mansion world.
Leave rehabilitation to the Mansion Worlds
MM: Yes, that’s correct. The rehabilitation of the individual in the mansion worlds is none of your concern. Your concern is maintaining and creating societies that are helpful, hopeful, compassionate, and generous in assisting individuals to become more mature in their behavior, and particularly to protect the well-being, the organizational matrix of society itself. Thank you.
Recca: Thank you.
Influencing at a distance
JT: Okay, Juan has submitted a question in writing to me. He says, “Many times we are not close to people who decide the fate of the world. What opportunities do we have to show from a distance or influence them regarding the fruits of the spirit? Thank you.
MM: This is Machiventa. Thank you, Juan, for your question. The interest that you have is to show from afar the sincerity of your heart and your actions to have an effect. This too is something that you must be concerned about in the here and now, in the right now, in the community and the family where you live, work, or go to school. Your influences afar are a distraction. You are far from almost all decision makers around you, even close to you in your nation. So, your concern must be for living right, correctly now, and for making good decisions now, and that you yourself do not take any actions that are detrimental to another person, to yourself, or to your society. This way you become a much more ethical and moral individual who truly wants to do good wherever you are. And this is one of the most generous gifts that you can give anyone near or afar. This may not be the answer you were seeking, but this is the answer that works for us. Thank you.
JT: Well, we're out of time. Do you have a closing for us?
You are developing great soul-value
MM: Certainly. This is Machiventa. You are seeing firsthand the fruits of living on a damaged world. You are seeing firsthand the actions that are generated from detrimental childhoods and adulthoods, and you are seeing the damage done from organizations that would rather make a good profit and get the opposition out of the way than doing good. On the other hand, looking at this in such a long-term perspective, you are in the process of generating souls whose soul-value will be much like a loaded dump truck in a traffic of bicycles.
Your soul-value and your soul-worth and the capacity of your earthly experience will go with you forever into the Corps of Finality. And along the way, you will have compassion for those worlds which also are in desperate straits of existence. You are becoming vessels of immense wisdom—vessels and tomes of wonderful prose, wonderful wisdom to share with others along the way during your lifetime. You are becoming sage, wise individuals in your communities. And rather than being a member of a chanting, marching protest, you are living quietly, making waves among children with the words of wisdom that you share. Realize that you have a tremendous influence on your peers even in homes of the elderly (collective group homes or individual homes). You have a source of wisdom for those younger generations among you, and you are one who counts and walks among those who envy you. Thank you and good day.
JT: Thank you, Machiventa, and thank you Daniel.